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Rank: Advanced Member  Joined: 10/24/2010 Posts: 694 Points: 1,038 Location: Florida
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bigritchie wrote:Me and some of my old Marine Corps buddies celebrate the Marine Corps birthday and have a few beers and laugh about old times. It is "tradition" and is a "man-made" feast day. I confess, that I, too am guilty of this particular sin. A really good Marine Corps Birthday celebration should carry on well into Veteran's Day. (For you slimey-civilians out there this means that party starts on November 10th and should go on into the 11th.) ("Carrier-Quals" usually begin at about 0230 on the 11th) bigritchie wrote: Messianic dogma aside, why wouldn't Y'shua go hang out with everyone and have a great time celebrating the holiday? It is not pagan. Everyone knows it isn't in the Torah. It is simply some fun Jewish Culture. Dan Certainly is not telling everyone that it is a "law" or that you are going to hell if you do not keep it. Indeed. Lighting our first candle tonight! Nehemiah wrote:"We carried our weapons with us at all times, even when we went for water" Nehemiah 4:23b
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Rank: Member  Joined: 6/19/2009 Posts: 137 Points: 435 Location: San Antonio, Texas
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bigritchie wrote:Me and some of my old Marine Corps buddies celebrate the Marine Corps birthday and have a few beers and laugh about old times. It is "tradition" and is a "man-made" feast day. That sure does not mean I do not get together with buddies and have fun and enjoy it. (I personally do not think the Creator of the Universe is going to hate me forever, because I kept a "feast" that was not in that book!) That has nothing to do with what is being discussed. Trying to connect Yahoshua with Hannukkah doesn't work because "scripture" simply does not say Yahoshua celebrated Hannukkah at all because it tries to bridge a gap between the Torah, Yahoshua, the Talmud, the Maccabees, etc. bigritchie wrote:Messianic dogma aside, why wouldn't Y'shua go hang out with everyone and have a great time celebrating the holiday? It is not pagan. Everyone knows it isn't in the Torah. It is simply some fun Jewish Culture. Dan Certainly is not telling everyone that it is a "law" or that you are going to hell if you do not keep it. Yahoshua did celebrate Yahweh's seven called out feasts, but it doesn't say he celebrated Hannukkah. Again it is leading people away for Yahweh's seven called out feasts towards rabbincal judaism. Quote:Matt.23
[13] But woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye shut up the kingdom of heaven against men: for ye neither go in yourselves, neither suffer ye them that are entering to go in.
[14] Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayer: therefore ye shall receive the greater damnation.
[15] Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye compass sea and land to make one proselyte, and when he is made, ye make him twofold more the child of hell than yourselves.
[24] Ye blind guides, which strain at a gnat, and swallow a camel. Hey, why not just celebrate christmas, easter and halloween while we're at it? It's all in good fun. They are pagan, but what the heck, it's just so we can do some out reach and spread the good and beneficial message. Hannukkah isn't pagan per se, but it doesn't lead to Yahweh, it leads to rabbincal judaism and the talmud. bigritchie wrote:I think the real historical Jesus would be very different then all of our opinions of him. (Not to mention if you read closely the prophets have something to say about various feast, and how the Creator feels about them, and even ask over and over "WHY in the WORLD are you sacrificing animals, I did NOT tell you to do that"!) And lastly Yahweh did have animal sacrifice on his feasts.
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Rank: Advanced Member Joined: 10/24/2010 Posts: 694 Points: 1,038 Location: Florida
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MadDog wrote:Yahoshua did celebrate Yahweh's seven called out feasts, but it doesn't say he celebrated Hannukkah. ...and Yochannon doesn't say that He didn't. (If you will pardon the double negative!) Shalom, out. Nehemiah wrote:"We carried our weapons with us at all times, even when we went for water" Nehemiah 4:23b
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Rank: Advanced Member  Joined: 9/7/2008 Posts: 538 Points: 1,548
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Daniel wrote:...and Yochannon doesn't say that He didn't.
(If you will pardon the double negative!)
Shalom, out. ...and Yochannon doesn't say that He didn't marry Mary Magdalene, doesn't say that he didn't travel to India to study with the Hindu's, doesn't say that he didn't come to North America to teach the American Indians, doesn't say that he didn't drive a porsche! You can't prove something with nothing. I think you ask for pardon because you subconsciously know that your double negging adds up to a meaningless grouping of words. “Because he clings to Me, is joined to Me, loves and delights in Me, desires Me, therefore I will deliver him, carry him safely away, cause him to escape from harm making him inaccessible and strong, and delivering him safely to heaven, because he has known, observed, cared for, recognized, instructed and advised others to use, designated, acknowledged, discerned, answered in, My name, authority, character, report, mark, and nature." Psalm 91:14
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Rank: Advanced Member Joined: 10/24/2010 Posts: 694 Points: 1,038 Location: Florida
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The tone many of you guys take is repulsive. Nehemiah wrote:"We carried our weapons with us at all times, even when we went for water" Nehemiah 4:23b
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Rank: Advanced Member Joined: 9/7/2008 Posts: 538 Points: 1,548
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Or perhaps you are reading into the text what is not there. “Because he clings to Me, is joined to Me, loves and delights in Me, desires Me, therefore I will deliver him, carry him safely away, cause him to escape from harm making him inaccessible and strong, and delivering him safely to heaven, because he has known, observed, cared for, recognized, instructed and advised others to use, designated, acknowledged, discerned, answered in, My name, authority, character, report, mark, and nature." Psalm 91:14
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Rank: Advanced Member Joined: 10/24/2010 Posts: 694 Points: 1,038 Location: Florida
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In His Name wrote:doesn't say that he didn't drive a porsche! Of course not! He was Jewish, he would drive a Mercedes! (or perhaps a Cadillac) In His Name wrote:You can't prove something with nothing. No, you cannot prove something with nothing, but Inductive Logic is allowed. Sometimes what is NOT said is important, too. By reading chapter 7 of Mark's account we can induce that Yeshua seems to have practiced ritual hand washing before eating meals. (The religious guys said 'how come your followers don't all do the hand washing thing?' rather than 'why don't YOU do the hand washing thing?' The logical leap being that if He hadn't done 'the hand washing thing' they would have jumped all over that.) I think that it is legitimate to logically induce that Yahushua washed His hands before meals in the traditional manner and participated in Hanukkah for the same reason: Both of these practices honor YHWH. I could be wrong. The texts that we have allow for this conclusion to be logically made, they do not speak against it, but they do not definitively support it either. Brothers, we can have different interpretations of the material. If you don't want to participate in Hanukkah, or wash your hands before meals for that matter, don't do it. NO ONE IS SAYING YOU MUST! (But I did see a sign that stated "Employees must wash hands before returning to work.") Nehemiah wrote:"We carried our weapons with us at all times, even when we went for water" Nehemiah 4:23b
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Rank: Member Joined: 6/19/2009 Posts: 137 Points: 435 Location: San Antonio, Texas
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Daniel wrote:The tone many of you guys take is repulsive. Ditto. Daniel wrote:I could be wrong. Yes, you are wrong. Daniel wrote:Brothers, we can have different interpretations of the material. If you don't want to participate in Hanukkah, or wash your hands before meals for that matter, don't do it. NO ONE IS SAYING YOU MUST! The problem I have with Hannukkah is that it can lead people (even more) away from Yahweh to rabbinical judaism. I did for a couple of years tried to observe hannukah but it didn't take because of it's religious trappings. Christians, mooooslimes, and jews have a massive edge on controlling Yahweh's message and hannukah is just another step away from the narrow path Yahweh has paved for us. You may know the difference and recognize the fine line, but others will not and there you are encouraging a seemingly innocent step in the wrong direction.
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Rank: Member
Joined: 10/26/2008
Posts: 374
Points: 915
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Again agree with you MadDog
It's not of Yah, it's not part of path to His Way, so at minimum it's an irrelevant diversion.
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Rank: Member
Joined: 5/10/2010
Posts: 12
Points: 18
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“You should not continue to add things (lo’ yasap – you should not incessantly increase or consistently incorporate something else (hiphil imperfect)), coming with and bringing (la bow’ – arriving with wanting to include (hiphil infinitive construct)) an offering (minchah – presenting and sacrificing) which is futile and worthless, pagan and idolatrous (shawa’ – vain and spurious, forged or counterfeit) while burning incense (qatoreth). It (hy’) is an abomination, a disgusting ritual, a repugnant religious practice, and a form of worship which is repulsive (tow’ebah – a loathsome and abhorrent thing, idolatrous and adulterous, objectionable and of the occult, ethically and morally inappropriate and corrupting) to Me (la).” (Yasha’yah / Yah Saves / Isaiah 1:13)
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Rank: Member
Joined: 9/30/2010
Posts: 203
Points: 567
Location: westen new york
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Daniel, seems to me you are trying to drive a nail without a point into the wood. Cannot be done, moreover should not. Give it up. I stumble over the "Yeshua" references. Who is he? I admire your fortitude but question your objectives.
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Rank: Advanced Member  Joined: 1/19/2010 Posts: 512 Points: 1,557 Location: WA - The Evergreen State
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Daniel wrote:
Brothers, we can have different interpretations of the material. If you don't want to participate in Hanukkah, or wash your hands before meals for that matter, don't do it. NO ONE IS SAYING YOU MUST!
We know that the rabbis and everyone who chooses to follow the Talmud are our Father's sworn enemies. We know that His Son regularly and consistently rebuked them and called them out for their presumptuous teachings and behavior. Why then would those of us who really love Yahowah want to have anything at all to do with anything those children of the slanderous adversary do or say? Why, Daniel, do you continue to try to honor the rabbis over our Father by pretending that anything they do or say is worth anything at all? They are our enemies; they hate our Father; they despise and corrupt His Word; and they have made it a crime to speak His Name. And you want to hang with them? I have to sidle on up next to tagim on this one, man. If my tone seems harsh, so be it. This is not patty-cakes; we are not playing a game. Consorting with our Father's sworn enemies is unwise and inappropriate. I still love ya, Daniel, but ... C'mon, man!
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Rank: Advanced Member
Joined: 1/29/2011
Posts: 609
Points: 1,935
Location: Houston, Texas
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[quote=flintface] I have to sidle on up next to tagim on this one, man.quote]
I must admit my ignorance, for as long as I'm living I have always thought the phrase was, "saddle on up next to."
I since have looked it up, and boy do I feel stupid.
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Rank: Advanced Member Joined: 10/24/2010 Posts: 694 Points: 1,038 Location: Florida
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flintface wrote:Why, Daniel, do you continue to try to honor the rabbis over our Father by pretending that anything they do or say is worth anything at all? You are accusing me falsely. I don't give a rat's-ass what the Rabbi's or the Pope, Obama or Craig Winn do/don't do about celebrating the defeat of the Greeks and the re-dedication of the temple. My understanding of Yochanon's first hand testimony is that Y'shua participated in the celebration of the defeat of the Greeks at the hands of Y'huda the Maccabee*. If He did it, I am doing it. You guys can carry on this discussion without me. *I see how other people can have a different understanding, too. Nehemiah wrote:"We carried our weapons with us at all times, even when we went for water" Nehemiah 4:23b
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